Eastern European historian Karl Schlögel calls on Germany to fundamentally correct its policy towards Russia and warns against naivety towards President Vladimir Putin’s ulterior goals. “Russia is the enemy”Schlögel, a leading Russian expert, told the German Press Agency. “Russia is a state that has started a war in Europe and the Germans must prepare. That means being ready to defend, being ready to defend yourself.”
The 76-year-old historian (“Moscow 1937”, “Decision in Kiev. Lessons from Ukraine”), who taught in Konstanz and Frankfurt an der Oder, will receive the renowned Gerda Henkel Prize on Monday in Düsseldorf. More recently, he turned to the United States with the book “American Matrix” (2023) and told the story of the 20th century as a story of the intertwining of the empires of the United States and the Soviet Union.
“We are already in a war situation,” Schlögel said. “A war doesn’t start overnight; there are preliminary phases.” Russia is trying to “dismantle the EU” and trigger escape movements. Eight million Ukrainians were displaced by the Russian war of aggression. “There are constant attempts at interference, acts of sabotage, attempts to exploit political parties, i.e. the AfD and “Russia is testing how far it can go”.
In Germany the issue of “war and peace” will be a central point in the federal election campaign, Schlögel said. But in Germany the gravity of the situation and the decisive turning point have not yet become known to public opinion. “But you still believe you can somehow escape this confrontation. The best solution is for Ukraine to calm down, leave us alone and make peace. It would be the abandonment of Ukraine, which at the moment is not only defending itself.”
How can historical perspectives shape modern diplomatic strategies towards countries like Russia?
Interview Between Time.news Editor and Historian Karl Schlögel
Time.news Editor (TNE): Welcome, Karl Schlögel. It’s a pleasure to have you with us today. Your insights on Eastern European history and your expertise on Russia are invaluable, especially in today’s geopolitical climate. Let’s dive right in. You recently emphasized the need for Germany to fundamentally reassess its policy towards Russia. What prompted this call to action?
Karl Schlögel (KS): Thank you for having me. The situation in Europe has become increasingly precarious. For too long, there has been a prevailing mindset, particularly in Germany, that seeks to engage with Russia through a lens of cooperation and diplomacy. While those goals are noble, they have often been overshadowed by a serious misunderstanding of Putin’s aggressive intentions. We need to recognize that when I say “Russia is the enemy,” I mean that we must understand the actions of the Russian regime through a critical and realistic historical perspective.
TNE: Many would argue that maintaining dialog is crucial for stability. How do you reconcile the need for engagement with your warnings against naivety?
KS: Dialogue is indeed important, but it cannot be conducted from a place of weakness, ignorance, or idealism. Engaging with Russia must be grounded in an understanding of its historical context and its current leadership’s geopolitical strategies. Putin is not simply an adversary; he embodies a regime that seeks to destabilize Europe and assert its dominance. Hence, any diplomatic efforts should be coupled with a clear-eyed recognition of the risks involved.
TNE: You mentioned the historical context. Can you elaborate on how history informs your perspective on current Russian policies?
KS: Of course. History plays a vital role in shaping national identities and policies. Russia has a long history of expansionism and a desire for spheres of influence. Putin taps into this past to legitimize his current actions, portraying them as a response to perceived threats from the West. This historical narrative has been manipulated to foster nationalism and justify aggressive posturing. Germany must understand this background to avoid repeating past mistakes, such as operating under the illusion that economic ties alone can secure peace.
TNE: That’s a striking point. Many believe economic interdependence could prevent conflict. How do you respond to that argument?
KS: Economic ties can create a web of mutual interest, true. However, when one party does not share the same values of democracy and cooperation, those ties can become a double-edged sword. Russia has shown that it is willing to leverage its energy resources and create dependencies as tools for coercion. Germany must recognize that a strong and unified response to Russian aggression requires a reevaluation of these economic dependencies. Relying on Russia for energy, for example, is a strategic vulnerability.
TNE: You’ve painted a rather bleak picture regarding Russia and its ambitions. What recommendations would you propose to German policymakers moving forward?
KS: The first step is Acknowledgement. Policymakers must accept that the previous strategies of engagement have not yielded the necessary security guarantees and have, in fact, made Europe more vulnerable. Germany should lead in promoting a unified European stance on Russia, focusing on strengthening NATO and enhancing support for Eastern European countries that feel threatened. Additionally, investing in alternative energy sources is crucial to reduce dependency on Russian gas.
TNE: It sounds like a proactive approach is essential. Do you think there is a reluctance among German leaders to adopt this kind of stance, and if so, why?
KS: Absolutely. There’s a historical reluctance that stems from the complexities of Germany’s past, particularly post-World War II. Many leaders are cautious of escalating tensions, fearing a return to Cold War-style hostilities. However, the danger lies in allowing this appeasement to obscure the realities of the present. It is essential to confront these fears and to choose a policy that recognizes the potential threat posed by Russia while also being firm in supporting democratic values.
TNE: It’s clear that your perspective challenges conventional thinking. Before we conclude, what message would you like to leave our viewers regarding this topic?
KS: I’d emphasize the importance of critical thinking and informed dialog. Engaging with Russia requires us to discard idealism for realism – ‘hope is not a strategy.’ We must collectively foster a nuanced understanding of the dangers ahead while remaining steadfast in our commitment to democratic principles. History should not only be a lens through which we examine the present but also a guide that informs our future actions.
TNE: Thank you, Karl Schlögel, for your compelling insights. It’s vital that we continue to engage in conversations like this as we navigate the complexities of international relations.
KS: Thank you for the opportunity to discuss these critical issues.
TNE: Until next time, stay informed and engaged.